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I Can’t Get to My Prospects
Are you fed up with not getting hold of your prospects? Learn to use the HBDI quadrant to your advantage and get prospects to reply. Join us in this fourth instalment of this HBDI series with Darren Smith and George Araham.
You Can Read the Full HBDI Transcript Below:
Darren A. Smith
Hi and welcome to the world’s stickiest learning. I’m here with George Araman. George, how are you?
George
Hi Darren, I’m good. How are you?
George
I’m sure it won’t be.
Darren A. Smith
Hey, I’m good. I’m good. I’m excited about our next podcast, so I’m gonna read out the title ’cause. It’s a bit of a mouthful, but I think it works. I can’t get my prospects to reply. Use HBDI to get your prospects to reply. So that’s the title of our 4th podcast on HBDI. George is going to be excited for the next 20 minutes. What do you think about that title?
Darren A. Smith
That’s certainly the plan.
George
Well, show me the money like they say so I’m pretty sure people are gonna like our audience are really gonna love it.
George
Yes.
Darren A. Smith
Fantastic. Fantastic. So let’s do a few minutes bringing people up to speed on HBDI so we don’t want to make an assumption they know now you’ve kindly lent us your profile for HBDI. So HBDI is the Herman brain dominance instrument. It’s a way of understanding how people think. And this is your profile. It’s split into four quadrants as everyone’s is now. George, what does the left brain normally mean?
George
So the left brain is more of the rational brain. It’s more of the logical brain. Whereas the right side of the brain is more the emotional side of the brain or more, the idea, the onceptualising side of the brain.
Darren A. Smith
Fantastic. So HBDIL, Hermann, asks us to understand our thinking preferences. Now, Hermann. Ned. Herman back in the 70s, split it also into the top half of the brain in the bottom half of the brain, giving us these four quadrants. Now, Herman, colour them as well. Obviously, they’re not coloured in our head, but they are coloured here. So the further your profile goes towards this outer circle, the more you prefer to think in that way. But you can do all four of these.
George
Yes.
Darren A. Smith
Alright, now let’s see from our other podcasts. George, what does the Blue quadrant mean?
Darren A. Smith
Yes.
George
So the blue is analytical side of things. This is the part where I don’t really enjoy doing for me. Facts tend to be more boring, very flat, and very not imaginative. I’m more into the imagination side of things. The creativity. I think Leonardo da Vinci would agree with me somehow. Yeah.
Darren A. Smith
I think he was. I think he worked and you’re in good company. Alright. So this is the fax. The fax quadrant will use an F just to make it easy. This is the future quadrant. And you talked about creativity. Entrepreneurs love this quadrant and this is where you are. You’re quite creative. Lots of ideas. Then as we come down here, the Red Quadrant. Let me quiz you. What’s the red quadrant?
George
So the Red Quadrant is more about the relational side of the quadrant. It’s more like we liked how we relate with others. It’s more about the passion we bring into it. It’s about like you mentioned in one of our podcasts that for example, the red is very important because they tend to bring the team together and it’s so even if sometimes people might think they’re not really actually adding value, they are in the back scenes and they’re really. Only the team together in a very efficient and effective way and even energising others to have better and more efficient results.
George
Yeah.
Darren A. Smith
You’re absolutely right. You’re absolutely right. And it’s the Red Quadrant that largely gets to dismissed by people because it’s emotional and particularly as a British man, I’m not supposed to show any emotion. I get that. The thing is, it’s the red that drives us. You know, it chooses our career. We’re passionate about retailing or engineering or whatever it is. It all comes from this Red quadrant. Let’s move on to our last quadrant. Coming back to the left brain, now green, this is our project management. So this is feeling.
George
Planning.
Darren A. Smith
This is form. What do you remember around the green one?
George
So green is about planning. It’s about structures, it’s about systems. It’s about like building systems, following structures, following rules, following guides. Being very like efficient on time, it’s about time management. It’s about all those like Stricker to the rules and very particular and very it’s a box basically putting someone in a box.
Darren A. Smith
Perfect. Perfect. All right. So our four quadrants go blue, which is our fax based quadrant over to yellow, which is our future based quadrant. Red is our feelings quadrant and form structure is our green quadrant. Now just to reiterate, we can do all four, but the metaphor I use because I’m a yellow, I’m a creative, I talk in metaphors. I get that and it has its strength and its weakness as do all quadrants. The metaphor I use. Is that I can do yellow in fifth gear.
Darren A. Smith
It’s quite easy for me. The idea’s come to me quite a lot, whereas green I do it more like first gear. I can do it but it’s hard and that’s how we all should look at our profile. There are things that are easier for us to do and things that are harder for us to do.
George
Exactly.
Darren A. Smith
OK, so when you originally saw your profile, which was a few weeks ago now because we’ve done a few of these podcasts, what did you think in terms of that mirroring you or not?
George
Oh, it was spot on like, because basically when I did the test and I was asked the question where do you see like your own quadrants. I was more or less at 0.001 degree. Exactly where, where I got the results because I already knew. I know that I’m like my yellow and red are very prominent, the green is more when I’m at work and OverDrive and the blue is like I’d rather delegate it to someone else or.
Darren A. Smith
Fabulous. Now I get that I get that and also just for interest you’ve seen on your profile there’s a solid black line showing where you prefer to think and also a dotted line. The dotted line is how we work, sorry, how we are under pressure. And normally pressure equals work in the modern day ’cause, there aren’t many jobs now where you can sort of just not do a great deal. Unfortunately, like there were in the 80s. So you have two profiles and they don’t always change, but they can do. So you have the profile of how I think normally and the profile of how I think when I’m under pressure and some people’s change and distort others don’t.
George
Like me. Yes. Yeah.
Darren A. Smith
Like yours so well, it’s just on yours. They won’t be able to see it on the camera, but what basically happens when you’re under pressure is you actually go more green. You look for more structure and you do less red, so you are less emotional. How? How does that manifest itself in real life? Yeah. OK.
George
So usually when I when I’m at work, I really I love plan planning systems and I spend like lots and lots of time building the perfect system. Maybe it’s the fear of whatever. So I build the systems and then I move to either the ideas or the facts and then like I the people or the red side, I leave it on really the very, very end. So yeah, this is how I would do it. Yeah.
Darren A. Smith
All right. And what we’ve talked about in other podcasts is how Herman and understanding your profile can help you in negotiation or in conflict. The way I like to understand the what I think is the biggest advantage of Herman is it enables us to talk with each other about each other in the third person. So, for instance, I might say, oh, I see why you need that meeting where you see the whites of my eyes because you’re red or a green might say, OK, I see why you need a plan. I might say to agree, I see why you need a plan because you’re agreeing you want to see, want to see all this in next steps.
Darren A. Smith
And it can help us avoid some of that conflict. But let’s come back to the title of what we’re talking about today. Prospects. So would you just bring to life? What do you think’s going on in the real world? Why are people fed up with not being able to get hold of their prospects?
George
Well, my guess is as good as anyone, but I would say that. They’re probably not using their own quadrant to their advantage. So for example, a rent when they I’m pretty sure that each quadrant has an advantage or a specific way that would make them convince a prospect in a better way. And it also goes to like in both ways, knowing the prosper which in which quadrant the prospect is helps a lot in order to help to like. Talk to them the way they want to be talked to and the way they want to be heard in order to give them what they want. That makes sense.
Darren A. Smith
Let me try and put you on the spot a little bit. I work on a Mac that’s here. If I was trying to sell that over, let’s say an e-mail marketing campaign and I was talking to a blue or I thought I’ll try and connect with the Blues, what things might I share with them about this Mac that I’m trying to sell? Yes.
George
So since you’re selling a Mac, you and you’re talking about the blue Quadrant. You’re probably going to emphasise on facts, so it’s going to be like probably the pricing how much the Mac would cost, why it’s better like you compare it to other to the, to APC, for example, why the Mac is better than the PC, what are the configurations? The like how many people bought the Mac versus how many people bought the PC. Those kind of things. So it’s basically numbers.
Darren A. Smith
Yes, I could perfect.
George
You’re putting all the good use of numbers, the good numbers that are better than like other competition. Yeah.
Darren A. Smith
Perfect. So I might list the process of speed I might list the gigahertz, all those nerdy type things, those facts. And there might be a payment plan that looks like this as well. Fabulous. Fabulous. All right. Well, let’s go round because it gets a little bit harder as we go round this quadrant, but I’m sure we can do it together. So if we’re talking to the yellows, what might we talk about if we’re selling this Mac to them, do you think? Yep.
George
Well, you just reminded me of Steve Jobs, and he’s at his, like, publicity or idea of the iPod when he said when he said so it’s basically that, like basically setting the 1000 songs in an iPod or something like that. It’s in a way similar to we could use a similar analogy to a laptop. So saying for example, like with thousand movie in a laptop or whatever. Something like that.
Darren A. Smith
It could be it could be. I think we also need to put the Mac in the bigger picture and maybe we’re selling more of a lifestyle. So it might have an image of the person with their Mac under their arm going to the coffee shop because it’s part of what they’re doing and then they’re in the coffee shop and then they’re on the train. And this open things opening quite quickly. And what we’re trying to do is paint that future vision lifestyle for them. And so maybe go. Yes.
George
Going on, I was just gonna say digital nomads like would really actually love that. And they’re like, always travelling and going to places. And then so this would be a really good thing.
Darren A. Smith
It would, it would, and maybe a 32nd video might just bring that whole lifestyle together and they can visualise them using it in this place and that place and how quick it is and some of those other things. OK, so we’ve nailed the Blues and the yellows. All right, let’s talk about the Greens. So these guys are into the next steps. They’re project managers, how do we sell this Mac to them, do you think?
George
So here we’re probably gonna emphasise on structure and.
Darren A. Smith
Yep.
George
I think here we would bring in the processes and how the Mac is more efficient than, for example the PC or any other competition we would bring in, for example the different tools we can use in the Mac in Mac that we’re not able to use in PC. And the floor is yours. Yeah.
Darren A. Smith
Mm hmm. Yep. Yep. OK. No, that’s all right. It gets a little bit harder with these colours, doesn’t it? So one of the things that these guys might appreciate is the timeline from ordering to arrival, maybe a finance plan as well might help to them to understand it and that they’ll pay the Mac off by 2025 with this payment plan would be something that might be useful for them.
George
Yeah.
Darren A. Smith
These guys also want to understand the next steps. So let’s say that we. That out in terms of how the Mac might work for them, you can set it up like this and this will look like this and improve your productivity like this. So we might show them the options of the add-ons that the Mac has to improve productivity and how that links in a chain because that’s how these guys think almost in a chain coming together.
George
So in this for this particular quadrant then probably either like a conference or sending maybe a video of the product and how you to use the product. In this case the Mac would be actually a really good idea. This is what you’re saying, right?
Darren A. Smith
Yeah, yes, yes.
George
Mm hmm.
Darren A. Smith
Let’s try for our Reds now. These are our kinesthetic or our feely touchy type people. So over e-mail marketing that’s going to be really hard. So how do we sell this mag to them over e-mail.
George
Nostalgia, we use nostalgia.
Darren A. Smith
OK.
George
Like for example the Barbie phenomenon they I think they named it really good. I didn’t watch the movie, by the way. It’s just like from all the marketing buzz ever that I heard around that, it was really good because they used nostalgia and they brought back in a way, the days of Barbie and made it like home movement. So it’s basically this that we’re trying to do with the Red Quadrant. Yeah.
Darren A. Smith
It is. It is. I would also share testimonials. Now this could almost trip into the facts, the Blue Quadrant. But what? We’ll try and do is share testimonials about how people feel. Wow. It was the best thing I’d ever had when it opened it. The design was amazing. I could type so much quicker. The feel of it was wonderful. And what we’re trying to do is bring that to life for these people through other people that have said some things. So.
George
Especially influencers as well.
Darren A. Smith
Especially influencers. Very good point, very good point. So we’ve touched on how we might communicate in the language of our prospects and we have to try each one of these. So if we take an example, this might be quite challenging for both of us. But if we were selling McDonald’s.
George
OK.
Darren A. Smith
We would try and sell now, Ray Kroc, who founded McDonald’s, was all about the consistency of the burger. All we got to do is take that USP and then expand it into the four languages.
George
OK.
Darren A. Smith
It might be tricky for us to do now, but what I’m looking for is anyone who has ausp they’ve got to put it in all four languages and try and talk to their prospects in all four languages, one at a time and see if they’re floating their boat in different ways. Yes. Yes.
George
Beautiful. Beautiful. So for example, in this case, since MacDonald is basically a green quadrant, like when it was born, since it’s about systems, how would how would we replicate it? How would we replicate it for each of the four quadrants?
Darren A. Smith
Yeah. So.
George
Like communicated in.
Darren A. Smith
Yeah. So let’s say we’re Ray Crock. We’re trying to get investment from McDonald’s, which is one of the things he did. He might say to the blue Quadrant, the consistency will increase sales by 5% because that’s what customers are looking for.
George
OK.
Darren A. Smith
He might say to the investors for the Yellow quadrant that by having consistency we can have more franchisees right across America because consistency is what we’re looking for the Greens. He might describe the actual process of how we achieve that consistency in store. There’s a wonderful piece in the founder film on Netflix of a tennis court and how they lay out the different parts of the store. The restaurant, which is brilliant.
Darren A. Smith
And what we’re trying to do is take that USP and put it in the four quadrants. So for us, the world’s stickiest learning the facts might be the blue, OK, how sticky is it, how much behavioural change do you achieve more than anyone else? In the yellow, we’re looking for OK, over the next six months, we’ve got a learning culture happening more than anyone else because people are changing their behaviours and looking for more fabulous. And you can see how we might take each USP and communicate their quadrant differently.
George
Yeah. No, it’s interesting. Yeah.
Darren A. Smith
So let’s come back to the title of our podcast, and we need to wrap up in a moment. I can’t get my prospects to reply. Use HBDI to get your prospects to reply because there’s everyone’s frustrated with either being ghosted that they have had some communication or getting nothing back. So if it were an e-mail marketing campaign, I would encourage people to think of 1 quadrant at a time. And what you’re going to communicate now we’re limited on e-mail marketing. We’re limited to maybe a video or a text or a piece of or an image.
Darren A. Smith
It’s not long. It’s critical we know who we’re targeting now. The easier quadrants are probably the blue fax is easy. It gets a little bit harder when we get down to the red, but with some research is very possible.
George
Love it.
Darren A. Smith
So, George, what else do you think our viewers would need in order to get their prospects to reply?
George
So I’d just like to just mention it would be interesting is to do preliminary research before like working on the project or the product or the e-mail in this case by really actually going for example like you gave I think an example in one of the podcasts to go on LinkedIn and really research the person you’re going to target to understand what like the general energy, how they are talking, are they talking more about numbers, are they talking more about systems? Are they talking more about?
George
Feelings or people they know are they talk more about ideas. You can see that for example, by looking at the post they are commenting on or writing, you can look at like their profile, their bio, the way they put their picture and everything. This is super important because it will help us do a lot of like preliminary work for that.
Darren A. Smith
You’re right. You’re absolutely right. I I was talking about e-mail marketing to the masses. You’re talking about individual. Both are absolutely what we need to do. So let me give you a top tip on that. If you’re targeting one particular person as a rough rule of thumb, we can overlay the VKA model, which is visual kinesthetic auditory, which is roughly our learning inputs or our communication inputs and outputs with HDI.
George
I imagine this.
Darren A. Smith
Let me tell you how we might do that. So anyone that’s here or here is typically a visual learner on when you’re looking for their text or their profile. They might use words like C or they might be something like. I envisage this all right, so they’re the sort of, I imagine they’re the sort of things that would turn these guys particularly and to an extent, some of these guys. All right, when we come down to our Greens, we’re looking for things like next steps or timeline or time scale will be the sort of words that would indicate.
Darren A. Smith
We’re looking for a green, all right. And then if we come over to our Reds, our feeling people, our kinesthetic people, we’re looking for those words like feel. We’re looking for a lot of words around people.
George
I was gonna ask that, yeah.
Darren A. Smith
So on BKA, these are typically visual people. All right, so we might use images to turn them on. These guys are typically auditory. We’ve talked about words like here. So these guys are good. They look at their ears a lot. That’s it. And then we’ve got the feelings people here which are kinesthetics. Now I’m trying to take two models and overlay them. It doesn’t always work, but it can give us good targeted guesswork.
George
I think it’s brilliant. I think it’s it really gives at least for me like it gave me an idea of how to better like know from the keywords or from the words are using, how to reach out to the prospect and it’s really good. And I’m pretty sure like the audience, I don’t want to assume, but I think it’s going to be interesting.
Darren A. Smith
So my last piece is to issue a challenge to our readers to look at an e-mail and see if they can pick up some of these words and guess from an e-mail. This is obviously assuming they’ve had some limited communication, but they haven’t yet sold what they need to and see if they can understand which quadrant their prospects in, because if they can then they can start talking more French to the more German or whatever the language is that they really need to. And if they do, they’ll find that they get into a slipstream which is much easier for them.
George
Love it.
Darren A. Smith
Alright, George, any questions before we close?
George
So I do have a question. So the question is a bit. So what I’m trying to say is, let’s say we’re going talking with a prospect and who’s in one of the four particular quadrants. Let’s say for example the blue. How would you approach this prospect? In each of the different phases. So basically we’re going to be using all four quadrants, all four quadrants, but like probably you’re going to initially start with an emphasis on the Blue Quadrant first.
Darren A. Smith
OK.
George
But then would you go more towards the green the than the yellow, then the red or how would you do that? Like if we take an example of an e-mail for example, the first series of e-mail would be for example facts then then you would need a second e-mail. What would the second e-mail be more about? Is it still going to be fax or would you go more towards systems because you are close to or green in a sense or do you see what I’m trying to get at?
Darren A. Smith
OK. OK. I think so. If I understand your question. So if I’m doing e-mail marketing, mass marketing, I don’t know who my audience is and I’m sure they’re a combination of all four. I’m going to once a week do a blue, then the next week I’m going to do a yellow in no particular order. I just need to make sure in a month I’ve hit these people in all four languages to make sure I’ve covered what Herman call whole brain thinking.
George
That’s interesting.
Darren A. Smith
And then hopefully I get a prospect replying and if they reply on the blue, I probably know that they’re a blue. Let’s keep talking blue and if they reply, I’m green and so on. And what I’m trying to do is talk their language all the way through where I’ve got a start is stage one with an e-mail or emails covering the whole brain to see what floats their boat.
George
Love it. Thank you.
Darren A. Smith
OK, George, thank you. You have been at our podcast of I can’t get my prospects to reply, use HBBI to get your prospects to reply. I think we’ve shared a number of good tips for people to start using if you’d like to get your HBDI profile then please, the link will be on the website or on this podcast. It doesn’t cost that much. And it also really can help with teamwork, conflict, and negotiation. George, thank you again for your help.
George
Thank you, Darren. It was great being there with you.
Darren A. Smith
Thank you.
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